Speaking as a staunchly pro-lockdown and anti-the-vax person... People's politics cross all grounds. One needs to accept meeting and parting on issues as completely natural. I will help bolster your anti-vax rallies and tell you to go home on the lockdown protests. Some people like to join teams, and follow all the dictates regardless, b…
Speaking as a staunchly pro-lockdown and anti-the-vax person... People's politics cross all grounds. One needs to accept meeting and parting on issues as completely natural. I will help bolster your anti-vax rallies and tell you to go home on the lockdown protests. Some people like to join teams, and follow all the dictates regardless, but the people who were independent enough to stand against the masses on lockdowns or vaxes will be taking personal thought positions on everything. People change their positions on things as well, with more information. I could have moved anti-lockdown with the right information at the time. Once very anti-gun ownership, I could now be pro-gun ownership in this new threatening environment. Before I had children I was anti-abortion, and then later determined that abortion had to be there (because women will self-mutiliate), and I don't think that one will change now.
Hi Madeleine, of course we change positions over time, I myself have come to realise that there is rarely a “right” side to any of these contentious issues like abortion, where I fall is on the side of “safe, rare and medically necessary” and of course I’m mindful of the modern day celebration of endless infanticide that seems to have infected the circles of the modern Left in particular where abortions are now a cheaper form of birth control and personal responsibility. I am curious however ... you say you’re pro-lockdown? Can I ask why, was this at the beginning of covid before the truth was allowed to emerge into the public consciousness?
I never worried about a pandemic before, and although I recognised propaganda-type video (CIA standard) of the Wuhan outbreak, I did eventually consider original covid to be a disease that was dangerous for a lot of people. The information I was finally susceptible to came from a hospital account of the progress of the disease. In the circumstances where it was novel and quite transmissible, I considered that mass infection would overwhelm hospitals and create a public health hazard. I don't feel wrong in that, 3&1/2 years later. I wouldn't let people die or sicken if there was something I could easily to do to stop it, and locking down was a no-brainer for me. From the Victorian perspective, when it came to the 2nd lockdown, the whole of Australia was free and drinking 'beers' and we were locked out. What else could we do? The freedom protesters tormented most Victorians - I'm still PTSD over them. It wasn't a good political move on their part - unlikely to engender any sympathy for their cause. [NB: I also didn't have time for the 'Black Lives Matter' protests.] Nonetheless I joined them over the vaccines because I was quite sure that the vaccines would have a net negative outcome for health.
The information I didn't have at the time was that there were pharmaceuticals that may have helped mitigate the disease for most people, and thus obviate the need for lockdown. Although I wasn't naive about the medical regulatory world (I knew they would be malfeasant) I didn't know how satanic they could be. I thought that if there were helpful pharmaceuticals doctors would have the agency to administer them. When they said nothing could help I trusted that advice. If another pandemic came along they wouldn't get away with that. That said, I knew all about the vaccines and I was powerless to effect change. I couldn't even convince my own family.
The other aspect that could have brought a pause was a frank and painful public discussion about the debt burden of lockdown. It's barely acceptable to weigh up money against lives when pharma brings out a new pill and wants to charge $30,000 a pop to save a young mother with breast cancer. But the financial discussion was important because it ends up a massive burden. A slow thoughtful discussion could've changed my mind.
After seeing how difficult it was to stop infection in aged care homes over months in Victoria in 2020 I consider the "protect the vulnerable and everyone else stay free" to be an utter lie of the Great Barrington Declaration. We cough, they die. I accept that people may choose to walk around coughing, but they must accept the fact that others will die for their freedom - there's no 'protect the vulnerable'.
I am very bothered by the fact that we locked down 'for the vulnerable', and then health came along with their vaccines and killed the vulnerable.
I think death in general needs more discussion. We have been trained to promote life at all costs (probably among other things to enrich pharmaceutical companies), and yet I'm not someone who personally values a long life for myself. I wouldn't choose to live hooked onto a machine or slowly wasting in an aged care home. But others do have this value and I'll support it because 'playing god' isn't for me.
I think (or hope) through the fullness of time that you will realise (or have realised) that most of the so-called covid deaths up front in aged care or nursing homes globally were simple artefacts of medical malpractice ... Victoria was no exception. I can’t recall exactly, but over 80% of the “covid deaths” were from a handful of care homes, most of whom applied the same “end of life” care as the UK tragedy by withdrawing antibiotics and literally refusing to treat because the directives declared as much.
While I greatly appreciate your perspective, there never was a need for Covid “lockdowns” ... the entire edifice was a socio-political construct designed to inflate the fear and bring about the means for vaccines. Sorry, I can’t sugar coat it any more than that. Almost all elderly, moribund, immune senescent people who died in 2020 were of that ilk ... not killed by a novel pathogen but by a medical-industrial complex too atrophied to care for them, or incentivised to do the opposite. Those who did succumb naturally were almost entirely already ill with 2, 3 or even 4 morbidities.
The elderly who’ve died from 2021 onwards are largely immune-compromised because they were the chief target market of jabs and boosters ... here in WA over 90% of covid “deaths” remain in the elderly, who are the most jabbed cohort alive, these things kill, maim, and the idea that a “vaccine” (even if it worked) would be beneficial to the moribund elderly is virological insanity ... they do not help, because the elderly do not mount an immune response. The fact that treatments were suppressed is a whole other factor in which I could write another 1,000 words!
There was certainly medical malpractice. TGA and AHPRA friends seemed to be out to kill. But knowing that doesn't stop people dying. You can say "this was all a sham, to kill people", and I'd go "yeah - so are you going to save their lives? or let them [edit: be killed], excusing yourself from culpability and pointing at the psychopaths?" It seemed to me that Daniel Andrews was going to leave Victoria open, UK style, thence allowing the in-hospital murders. The people stood up against it, I thought, although there was probably some nudging. We saved, we dodged, for quite a while. It wasn't just the old people - there was a reduction in mortality across all ages from the 30s up. Maybe less stress, fewer infections. There was a lot of good community spirit, and the fact that a few people didn't like the lockdowns didn't mean everyone didn't. I personally thought the people made it happen, and the govt was forced to go along with it.
I'm pretty sure covid itself was a bioweapon. I don't think it was good for anyone to get it. I wanted the world to follow along with Aus & NZ.
The argument against lockdown is that perhaps we could've stopped [edit: the whole agenda], but mostly-open Sweden didn't stop the vaccines. Vaxing everyone appears to have been the whole goal.
Western Australia provides all the proof that this was all nonsense. Read Rebekah's Hermit kingdom article (and Aussie17 and ExcessDeathsAU on this platform). We had 963 days of SOE state of emergency and 697 days of hard border during which time there were ~1000 case of convid in the community. In this same period 98% of the O16 population got coerced into 2x and 3x jabs.
What happened when people could move : convid exploded = lockdown and vaxing in WA was utterly useless at PREVENTING infection, transmission, hospitalisation & death! This govt knows this because they continually REFUSE TO PUBLISH death rates, birth rates, miscarriages rates, turbo cancer rates, SADS, neuro disorders : all information they receive daily and weekly.
We agree on the whole purpose of everything (whether, left open with mass deaths/hospital murders/both, or locked down, or a bit of both) creating more imperative to support [the useless] mass-vaxing. I agree they've denied data - certainly I made many requests in Victoria and it wasn't provided.
I don't think we agree on the existence of a novel virus. When I eventually got the milder omicron, as an unvaxd person (age 61, a few extra kgs) it felt like something very novel. Though relatively mild in the acute stage I had a bit of a cytokine storm I had to deal with at day 5 and felt very damaged and susceptible in the immune system for about 5 weeks after. I think the first strains were a bit tougher, though perhaps not quite as contagious as they would've wanted.
to clarify; my description of convid refers to the entire plan/project. I am of the belief something was released and we don't yet conclusively know what it was (given all info comes from the perpetrators) but it was close to harmless if you were healthy. There was a plethora of early data that got quickly suppressed regarding vita D & IVM etc. If your vitamin D level is over 50ng/ml you very seldom get sick. The literature claims no one caught CV19 if vita D was >50ng/ml and certainly no one ended up in hospital with those levels. (Check Dr Simon Goddek as a starting point https://t.me/goddek/2142 ). So my point was/is that with proper nutrition, correct hormonal levels (Vit D) + vita C & zinc, IVM etc : there was zero need for lockdowns or a vax.
we look for silver bullet solutions and ideologies to lock on to, the 'right' ideology, too much. we get trapped into arguing on the ideolgy or belief, and they all have holes. my suggestion is we focus on simply not doing stupid stuff, or not lettin gov and corps do it to us. need to ridicule and not comply with illegal or counterproductive edicts. this extendsdown to the lowest level with local bureacracy, to not letting corps have same rights as a person. a wise woman told me last week ' Gov's are in the business of making crime legal'. say NO, do NO - be ungovernable, withdraw your goodwill from their society.
Speaking as a staunchly pro-lockdown and anti-the-vax person... People's politics cross all grounds. One needs to accept meeting and parting on issues as completely natural. I will help bolster your anti-vax rallies and tell you to go home on the lockdown protests. Some people like to join teams, and follow all the dictates regardless, but the people who were independent enough to stand against the masses on lockdowns or vaxes will be taking personal thought positions on everything. People change their positions on things as well, with more information. I could have moved anti-lockdown with the right information at the time. Once very anti-gun ownership, I could now be pro-gun ownership in this new threatening environment. Before I had children I was anti-abortion, and then later determined that abortion had to be there (because women will self-mutiliate), and I don't think that one will change now.
Hi Madeleine, of course we change positions over time, I myself have come to realise that there is rarely a “right” side to any of these contentious issues like abortion, where I fall is on the side of “safe, rare and medically necessary” and of course I’m mindful of the modern day celebration of endless infanticide that seems to have infected the circles of the modern Left in particular where abortions are now a cheaper form of birth control and personal responsibility. I am curious however ... you say you’re pro-lockdown? Can I ask why, was this at the beginning of covid before the truth was allowed to emerge into the public consciousness?
I never worried about a pandemic before, and although I recognised propaganda-type video (CIA standard) of the Wuhan outbreak, I did eventually consider original covid to be a disease that was dangerous for a lot of people. The information I was finally susceptible to came from a hospital account of the progress of the disease. In the circumstances where it was novel and quite transmissible, I considered that mass infection would overwhelm hospitals and create a public health hazard. I don't feel wrong in that, 3&1/2 years later. I wouldn't let people die or sicken if there was something I could easily to do to stop it, and locking down was a no-brainer for me. From the Victorian perspective, when it came to the 2nd lockdown, the whole of Australia was free and drinking 'beers' and we were locked out. What else could we do? The freedom protesters tormented most Victorians - I'm still PTSD over them. It wasn't a good political move on their part - unlikely to engender any sympathy for their cause. [NB: I also didn't have time for the 'Black Lives Matter' protests.] Nonetheless I joined them over the vaccines because I was quite sure that the vaccines would have a net negative outcome for health.
The information I didn't have at the time was that there were pharmaceuticals that may have helped mitigate the disease for most people, and thus obviate the need for lockdown. Although I wasn't naive about the medical regulatory world (I knew they would be malfeasant) I didn't know how satanic they could be. I thought that if there were helpful pharmaceuticals doctors would have the agency to administer them. When they said nothing could help I trusted that advice. If another pandemic came along they wouldn't get away with that. That said, I knew all about the vaccines and I was powerless to effect change. I couldn't even convince my own family.
The other aspect that could have brought a pause was a frank and painful public discussion about the debt burden of lockdown. It's barely acceptable to weigh up money against lives when pharma brings out a new pill and wants to charge $30,000 a pop to save a young mother with breast cancer. But the financial discussion was important because it ends up a massive burden. A slow thoughtful discussion could've changed my mind.
After seeing how difficult it was to stop infection in aged care homes over months in Victoria in 2020 I consider the "protect the vulnerable and everyone else stay free" to be an utter lie of the Great Barrington Declaration. We cough, they die. I accept that people may choose to walk around coughing, but they must accept the fact that others will die for their freedom - there's no 'protect the vulnerable'.
I am very bothered by the fact that we locked down 'for the vulnerable', and then health came along with their vaccines and killed the vulnerable.
I think death in general needs more discussion. We have been trained to promote life at all costs (probably among other things to enrich pharmaceutical companies), and yet I'm not someone who personally values a long life for myself. I wouldn't choose to live hooked onto a machine or slowly wasting in an aged care home. But others do have this value and I'll support it because 'playing god' isn't for me.
Information is very important.
I think (or hope) through the fullness of time that you will realise (or have realised) that most of the so-called covid deaths up front in aged care or nursing homes globally were simple artefacts of medical malpractice ... Victoria was no exception. I can’t recall exactly, but over 80% of the “covid deaths” were from a handful of care homes, most of whom applied the same “end of life” care as the UK tragedy by withdrawing antibiotics and literally refusing to treat because the directives declared as much.
While I greatly appreciate your perspective, there never was a need for Covid “lockdowns” ... the entire edifice was a socio-political construct designed to inflate the fear and bring about the means for vaccines. Sorry, I can’t sugar coat it any more than that. Almost all elderly, moribund, immune senescent people who died in 2020 were of that ilk ... not killed by a novel pathogen but by a medical-industrial complex too atrophied to care for them, or incentivised to do the opposite. Those who did succumb naturally were almost entirely already ill with 2, 3 or even 4 morbidities.
The elderly who’ve died from 2021 onwards are largely immune-compromised because they were the chief target market of jabs and boosters ... here in WA over 90% of covid “deaths” remain in the elderly, who are the most jabbed cohort alive, these things kill, maim, and the idea that a “vaccine” (even if it worked) would be beneficial to the moribund elderly is virological insanity ... they do not help, because the elderly do not mount an immune response. The fact that treatments were suppressed is a whole other factor in which I could write another 1,000 words!
There was certainly medical malpractice. TGA and AHPRA friends seemed to be out to kill. But knowing that doesn't stop people dying. You can say "this was all a sham, to kill people", and I'd go "yeah - so are you going to save their lives? or let them [edit: be killed], excusing yourself from culpability and pointing at the psychopaths?" It seemed to me that Daniel Andrews was going to leave Victoria open, UK style, thence allowing the in-hospital murders. The people stood up against it, I thought, although there was probably some nudging. We saved, we dodged, for quite a while. It wasn't just the old people - there was a reduction in mortality across all ages from the 30s up. Maybe less stress, fewer infections. There was a lot of good community spirit, and the fact that a few people didn't like the lockdowns didn't mean everyone didn't. I personally thought the people made it happen, and the govt was forced to go along with it.
I'm pretty sure covid itself was a bioweapon. I don't think it was good for anyone to get it. I wanted the world to follow along with Aus & NZ.
The argument against lockdown is that perhaps we could've stopped [edit: the whole agenda], but mostly-open Sweden didn't stop the vaccines. Vaxing everyone appears to have been the whole goal.
Western Australia provides all the proof that this was all nonsense. Read Rebekah's Hermit kingdom article (and Aussie17 and ExcessDeathsAU on this platform). We had 963 days of SOE state of emergency and 697 days of hard border during which time there were ~1000 case of convid in the community. In this same period 98% of the O16 population got coerced into 2x and 3x jabs.
What happened when people could move : convid exploded = lockdown and vaxing in WA was utterly useless at PREVENTING infection, transmission, hospitalisation & death! This govt knows this because they continually REFUSE TO PUBLISH death rates, birth rates, miscarriages rates, turbo cancer rates, SADS, neuro disorders : all information they receive daily and weekly.
We agree on the whole purpose of everything (whether, left open with mass deaths/hospital murders/both, or locked down, or a bit of both) creating more imperative to support [the useless] mass-vaxing. I agree they've denied data - certainly I made many requests in Victoria and it wasn't provided.
I don't think we agree on the existence of a novel virus. When I eventually got the milder omicron, as an unvaxd person (age 61, a few extra kgs) it felt like something very novel. Though relatively mild in the acute stage I had a bit of a cytokine storm I had to deal with at day 5 and felt very damaged and susceptible in the immune system for about 5 weeks after. I think the first strains were a bit tougher, though perhaps not quite as contagious as they would've wanted.
to clarify; my description of convid refers to the entire plan/project. I am of the belief something was released and we don't yet conclusively know what it was (given all info comes from the perpetrators) but it was close to harmless if you were healthy. There was a plethora of early data that got quickly suppressed regarding vita D & IVM etc. If your vitamin D level is over 50ng/ml you very seldom get sick. The literature claims no one caught CV19 if vita D was >50ng/ml and certainly no one ended up in hospital with those levels. (Check Dr Simon Goddek as a starting point https://t.me/goddek/2142 ). So my point was/is that with proper nutrition, correct hormonal levels (Vit D) + vita C & zinc, IVM etc : there was zero need for lockdowns or a vax.
we look for silver bullet solutions and ideologies to lock on to, the 'right' ideology, too much. we get trapped into arguing on the ideolgy or belief, and they all have holes. my suggestion is we focus on simply not doing stupid stuff, or not lettin gov and corps do it to us. need to ridicule and not comply with illegal or counterproductive edicts. this extendsdown to the lowest level with local bureacracy, to not letting corps have same rights as a person. a wise woman told me last week ' Gov's are in the business of making crime legal'. say NO, do NO - be ungovernable, withdraw your goodwill from their society.